mentalblog.com comments:
Tzemach, you are even more cynical than I am! Admitedly, there are lots of problems, but I would not go so far as to say the experiment of Chassidim is over. Remember,there is still the Chassidus, which is being learned by millions around the world, including non-Chassidim and even non-Jews, and it is a potent spiritual force purifying and elevating the world in ways we cannot always understand or perceive.
My theory, which many
Chabdniks will see as heresy, is the following: The Baal Shem Tov put a revolution into motion which was then lead by Lubavtich for a couple of centuries. Lubavitch were the trailblazers opening up new paths in Judaism that were then adopted by many other sects. But now it is no longer the leader. Lubavitch is no longer at center stage. So, perhaps the job of Lubavtich is in a sense finished? Perhaps its original purpose has been accomplished, and now it will be relegated to being not the leader or the trailblazer, but one of the many forms of Jewish expression in the world?
There are many in Lubavtich who are fighting very hard to keep Lubavtich in center stage, but this is a futile struggle, and to outside observers they only make a mockery of what made Lubavtich great which was its humility. For generations these Lubavtichers were used to being the revolutionaries, and now that the revolution has been won in so many areas of Jewish practice, they find themselves at a loss, not quite sure what their role should be. So instead of concentrating on being good, humble Chassidim, they still forge on trying to be NUMBER ONE LEADERS IN ALL AREAS OF JUDAISM. The problem with this is that these Chabadniks fail to recognize that the majority of Jews today are just not following them like in the old days.
I am now putting on my armour to protect me from the stones that will be hurled my way for stating this opinion. ;)
your post is nice, thank you, but it does not resonate with me and is historically naive. majority of Jews today are just not following them like in the old days.
Oh well, Tzemach, I gues I am not intellectual enough for you. Does being an intellectual mean you need to be as gloomy and pessimistic about Chassidim as you are?
What made you think Chassidus was suppossed to fix the world? Only Moshiach will do that, with all the success of spreading the wellsprings, this is till galus.
TA, I just have to pipe up here:
You are lumping together two separate & distinct endeavors, namely the intensely personal aveido and the very-very public communal activism. Despite the argument made by many that these are, by definition, mutually exclusive, the evidence I see from life experience (as in “seeing many folks in Lubavitch over a fairly long period of time”) tells me that:
1. Those individuals that take aveido seriously and “work” at it, shteien gornit op di eivdim fun amol
2. Among those people there are private individuals, yeishvei eihel, and, yes, also “activists” (sheluchim).
Where you really might have a point is that at this time we do not have a “culture” of aveidoh. Many seem to have forgotten that without iskafia and hisbeinenus, a person has little chance of being anything other than a thick-skinned misnagged in chassidishe garb, the degree of communal activism and devotion to the Rebbe notwithstanding. Without denying the fact that helping another Jew is a purifying experience, it is not a substitute for teiras hachassidus and darkei hachassidus. Nor was it ever presented as such by the Rebbe.
But I digress - the prevalent culture is not an excuse. It is still up to the individual to engage in a personal aveido al pi Teiras CHaBa”D.
Fiery words, Berl. My emphasis was on a dialogue and a moment when mortals and gods do not talk back. Hence stillness as in silence.
perhaps, sof davar hakol nishma - that at the end of this "experiment" you deemed it, the end is that we have to learn that family life is the center of Judaism - and that searching for a cure for aloneness and displacement is marriage, not chassidus.
then, within the stability of a togetherness, you and your wife can find out which derech to tread upon.
But one cannot substitute the other - "Al kein ya'azov ish..."
grose, while family is the center of Jewish life, it is not a substitute for a personal "dialogue with G-d."
nope it ain't a substitute, berl - but unless one has a family, unless one learns how to talk/interact in this here world in a relationship of family, one can have no clue as to how to build a relationship of family with G-d.
Everything here is just a Mashal a way of learning how to connect with Him. And the highest form of relationship here is marriage, which is the ultimate teaching tool for us how to bond with Him.
"but the path lead to buildings, chiefs, degrees, fundraising galore and blind fanatical partisanship."
Change "lead to" to "reverted to".
berl, you are so good! you remind me of those super-talented young jews who worked for the propaganda machine in the pre-war soviet union. keep up the good work!
So are you able to be still?
JSG, what are you asking?
I'm not so sure. I guess I'm assuming that by stillness you mean present moment awareness. Are you able to find the "off switch" that takes you away from this moment?
Grose: excellent, excellent point about the importance of family life and how it should take precedence over the marching orders of the movement (any movement). I unfortunately have witnessed the tension and stress that adherance to perceived Chabad haskofoh has brought into some families with disastrous results. This is particularliy true of Chabad wanna-be's who think they need to be more Catholic than the Pope to gain acceptance by the local mashpiah or shaliach. I have seen enough of this to conclude that these are not isolated incidents.
dont know where your getting your info. tzemach.
this week wer'e told on t.v. that chabad was established to provide shelter for the homeless, rehab for drug addicts and of course aid for hurricane victims!
I am confused, was the Hurricane a punishment for Gaza withdrawal or a G-d's gift to Cunin? I need a clarification dialogue with my local Rabbi.
TA, its both, and there is no need for a Rabbi, it's a פסוק, as always:
יתום ואלמנה יעודד, ודרך רשעים יעות
"... He supports shelters for the needy yet despises the ways of the wicked."
I was just wondering: How many people donate to the Telethon and think the money is actually going to "Chabad" and they are supporting their local shaliach?
I felt the 'stillness' you are refering to before becoming frum. In those days the world was a cold alientating scary place. In those days I was foreign to myuself, deadened inside,directionless, unable to surrender myself in a relationship. All that changed for the better after becoming frum. After Hashem became a reality for me, the world became less sterile and more alive. In fact, when I contrast my life from before becoming frum till now, it was like the difference between being deaf (before frum) and hearing the most beuatiful symphony (after frum) every day.
I feel very sorry for frum people who feel alienated. What is the point of doig the mitzvahs if you can't feel Hashem vibrant presence in your life? Hope any of you feeling that way find a way to get inspired and find meaning in lfe.
I have been frum and I have been frie, and frum is better! 8)
Berl, you wrote:
You are lumping together two separate & distinct endeavors, namely the intensely personal aveido and the very-very public communal activism.
Perhaps I am mixing different concepts but for me it was always that way. I feel communal as part of personal. Not a novel concept for Jews who need 9 others to talk to G-d properly.
Shoshana, frum macht frei!
TA, you are right. I just feel that we can't afford to give up on the "personal" solely because the "communal" is not as we would like it to be… But I am guilty as charged: I do not have a great emotional attachment to a “community”. A few good friends and an old-style farbrengenish where the same people say the same things (in different words) week after week, year after year, is all it takes to make me feel anchored.
frum macht frei!!! - LOL!!! terrible and funny.
Berl, as usual the 'propoganda' guy.
Kind of reverse N.K.V.D. The Chabadsker version.Sickening and dumb.
to all the past & future "propaganda" morons:
1. if you refer to WHAT I say and think I skew the truth - point out with specificity where in my comments I do so.
2. if you refer to WHY I say what I say – that's irrelevant since we do not have a personal relationship (and are not about to have one in the future).
3. if you just like to use words wihtout knowing their meaning (or how to spell them) - OK then.
berl, i refer to HOW :+: you say it!
Just like family relationships do not replace relationship with the Almighty and just like communal work does not replace avoda (although it must be said that according to the Rebbe's vision is IS PART OF AVODAS HACHASSIDUS)' so too: "iskafya and hisbonenoos" while the tools for refining the person to talk the ALmighty are not a replacement for the direct relationship that is gotten through "onochi omeyd ben Hashem Oovenechem" and therefore at all generations since the Alter Rebbe they did not suffice themselves with avodas hahisbonenoos and iskafya but it was in conjunction with the connections with the Rebbe that directly related to a chossid through amiras dach and yechidoos which was mehached umevarer and kovea avoydossoy and most importantly was the link begilooy to "Talk" and feel beoyfon hamechaber with Atzmoos Umehoos.
Very few do kiruv work like Chabad and such job is always in demand, so what are you sobbing about? And why are you saying that “every one of us is left as lonely and confused in this world as when we started” – did you conduct a pole? Thank G-d, I was fine most of the time – before and between.
Edited By Siteowner
I notice the kippah is distinctly in what nowadays would be considered Breslov style. Hmmm.
I thought in tzitzis, Breslov and Lubavitch minchag is the same.
same wool master?
I am not naive. I have seen terrible corruption within Lubav. I have been a victim of manipulative, exploitative, mean spirited, duplicitous, pious frauds within movement. I have had terrible experiences, have firsthand knowledge of actual scandals, and know the dark side about certain high profile Lubav. people that would shatter the illusions these people have successfully created in public that they are holy righteous people. If I were to ever make all this public, I fear my very life could be at stake, and this is no exaggeration. I would also run the risk of being branded as delusional because there would be many people who would simply be incapable of believing that certain figures within the movement, whose public images are squeaky clean, are actually people with malevolent intentions.
Having said all this, I am still passionately committed to the Torah, to Chabad principles, and to the Rebbe. I expect human beings to be flawed, only Hashem is perfect. The Rebbe to me was as close to human perfection that one could ever hope to known. He has been my rock, his tzidkus is what I always held onto while being cast upon the stormy seas of Lubav. hypocrisy, opportunism, fakery, and corruption.
To me the truth stands on its own regardless of what flawed weak human beings may do. And in times of hurt and pain, when feeling hard done by or victimized, where else to turn for solace and strength but to HaKodesh Baruch Hu? And He has never let me down! Nor has the Rebbe. :+:
Ms. Silcove, I do not see anything wrong with your writing, but "party intuition" tells me something don't smell right here.
What doesn't smell right? What is 'party intuition'? You make no sense at all. Please clarify.
this man had it, that illusive "party intuition"...
https://tspace.library.utoronto.c.../SCMEDIA/
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it is an ability to judge without having to rely on evidence - what we call "mariach vedoyen"...
Shoshana, we all know you as one of the few(only?)brave souls to stand up to the Mashchisen/Meshichisten years before their true evil showed thru,but, now you are the one equating the Rebbe to Hashem,r'l,both of them not letting you down?
P.S don't try to 'understand' 'Propaganda' Berl, he is not out there to make sense, rather obfuscate and push the party line.
Bostoner says "Shoshana, we all know you as one of the few(only?)brave souls to stand up to the Mashchisen/Meshichisten years before their true evil showed thru,but, now you are the one equating the Rebbe to Hashem,r'l,both of them not letting you down?"
Shoshanna says: Bostoner, you got me wrong on that! G-d forbid that I would equate the Rebbe with Hashem! However, the Rebbe is still part of my life since he is a source of constant inspiration and guidance through his teachings, and I also daven at the Ohel and send petitions to him to intervene, to put in a good word to Hashem on my behalf from the next world. For thousands of years Jews have been petitioning tzadikim who have passed away to help their prayers to Hashem get answered, and that is very Jewish. There is a big difference between that and praying to the Rebbe, which I think of as heretical, or attributing godlike qualities to the Rebbe, also heretical and avoda zora too. I merely say that he was the most perfect example of a Jew and a human being that I have ever encountered or could have imagined. That does not in any way imply he was or is a deity, G-d forbid, but a GREAT AND HOLY TZADIK with whom I still have a strong kesher with, even in his passing.
I also have a strong kesher with my step mom who passed away in Nov. and I feel her presence in my life. Again, this is all Torah.
I am clear?
Bostoner, at the risk of sounding a bit haughty, I wish to put your mind at ease - if you have trouble following my comments, it’s a sure-bet sign you are not a member of the intended "target audience". :)
I hereby second “bostoner’s” advice - no one should exert any energy in attempting to decipher my comments.
Wow! What depression!
guravitzer, you are callous. Is it an inherited familial quality or did you lovingly cultivate it yourself?
berl
"the prevalent culture is not an excuse. It is still up to the individual to engage in a personal aveido al pi Teiras CHaBa”D."
wether or not its an excuse is debatable, but its definitely the reason. where are people supposed to pick it up? individuals can only do so much.
back in the day they had mashpi'im with vision who actively encouraged aveidoh and provided plenty of guidance as well. more importantly, they provided an environment. people like greinem and shilem and later shleimeh chaim and nissen (and some others) worked hard to make tmimim into what they became.
this is non existent today.
if an individual should want to work on himself he has nowhere to turn for guidance. not to mention that someone should actualy get bochurim excited about the idea etc.
poor guravitzer. leave the guy alone
who should be left alone?
sto pratzent, there is no doubt that there is urgent need for an environment and a culture that are conducive to aveidoh and all things Jewish. We do not disagree on this.
However, G-d put me here now, in the year 5765, not in 5665. It is not in my power to change what is "out there", all I can do is try to be my best despite it all, or use it as an excuse for my stagnated state.
That I so often choose the latter does not make me blind to the fact that there are folks out there that keep choosing the former.
What I am saying is, "If they can do it, shouldn't I be able to do the same?"
Ahh, the good old days. They were much simpler, or were they?
It is nonsense to say a person can no longer work of themself.
Each neshoma is put into this world in each generation for a reason and a purpose.
Our avodah today has different challenges than it did a hundred years ago. Yet, we are not judged by the end result, but by the effort we put into our avodah. It's all in the journey.
We live in coarser times, and we are coarser ourselves, but we can still sweat and toil to refine ourselves. We most likely will never reach the refined level of our ancestors, but then again, does Hashem exepect us to? Of course not, since He put us here and He knows we are in a situation that makes it almost impossible to reach such a level.
However, we are still expected to do our best--like the Reb Zusha story--be yourself, and do YOUR avodah in the times and society Hashem placed you in.
Gut Yar!
That yarmulka is displayed in the Chabad Library Museum and is labeled as the Maharash's yarmulke.
Yehuda, follow the link under the picture. It says it is Alter Rebbe's yarmulka.
No, no, I'm not. I'll gladly pay for the medication, just to show how much I care.
I looked like the one I saw in the Library itself which was under the Mahrash's display. Which in itself is quite interesting that the Mahrash still wore white.
It* looked like
i am not a gung-ho, crazy mishichist. i am not a blind fanatic. i am a normal, average kid, who has her occasional moments of doubt and rebellion, some issues with tznius, and a love for reading books which are usually not jewish. i do not say "gimmel tammuz" but "the rebbe's yahrtzeit". this is not contradictory in any way - i am like any other lubavitch kid. but i have figured out what i believe in, and now that i am convinced of the truth of it, nothing can convince me of otherwise.
my belief is that the rebbe and lubavitch is right, and that you are wrong. regardless of whether chabad is accomplishing anything or not (and as a teenage daughter of hard-working shluchim, i can tell you that we definitely are doing something), this is what the rebbe sent us out to do. this is what we're doing.
chassidus has been along way before the besht came and spread it. the "experiment" has succeeded. it seems to me you are the only one confused by your own twisted sense of what you define chassidus to be.
shame on you. i googled the alter rebbe's signature for a project on him for school; instead i was linked to your website. if all you are doing is recording your own skewed sense of what is right and what is wrong, then please, type it up into a word document on your computer. there really is no need to influence the rest of us into your way of thinking.
(and as for your "next lubavitcher rebbe"? it leaves me wondering just how frum he can be, if he allows himself to be referred to like that.)
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