mentalblog.com comments:
schneur
the begining of the end of your "classical lubavitch" could be traced to the founding of toimchei tmimim
For me the end means the end of the Belorussian Jews. The advance of the ideological hordes of clones, mean and cold was largely during the rein of RaMaSH. It was his totalitarian invention and it is for all to see in CH today.
tzemach, you are being vulgar. i don稚 give a shit whether you are right or wrong. it is truly irrelevant.
an example of shneur's wisdom and knowledge of history:
http://www.haloscan.com/comments...34132855/
#76865
To Schnuer
The rebbe rayat配 was a mesiras nefesh yid and for that he is respected in all the chasidsche group even by the kanoim one will never hear anything derogatory about the Ryat配 so one should watch out how one writes about him
To sto prazent
If not tomche tmimim one wonders where lubavich would be today probably like Kopust Bobruisk Niezhin Liadi ect
The gerre rebbe had over one hundred thousand chassidim in poland and he decided to leave to eretz yisroel
The Knoim noticed when he was Moiser his Nefesh to the Zionists in exchange for Kfar Chabad ,but much earlier his tutor the Malcah noticed that he was Moser his Nefesh reading what was then considered taboo for a Yurei Shumeim instead of feeding his Nefesh with Gefes Or Musser ,the above two milestones resulted that today is Lubavitch is as modern today as the conservative leadership in America fifty years ago , and sliding
Firstly, let me state the following I am not criticizing the Rayatz , I am just explaining his actions. Gedolim like Reb Simcha Zelig Riger, the Belzer Rov, the Razferter rebbe and others all felt that in a time of bilbul hamochos it was hard if not impossible to state a daas torah.They each expressed it in a different verbal manner. I heard directly from the Bobover rebbe's brothr in law R. Maylech Rubin that his father the Tomoshover rebbea sked the Belzer rav what to do which direction to go when WW2 broke out and the rov told him that he does not know , but also told him what he himself would do.
Next I think that the Rashab saved chassidus chabad through TTL.
I re read my comments on the Red army, what I wanted to say is that the Red army never indulged in Pogroms during th Russian civil War that was the acts of the "White Russians , after the Second war it was the Russian Army that preserved the lives of the surviving Jews in Poland etc.
As far as the fighting in the Red army, we should be happy as Jews for the Russian tactic of using humans as cannon fodder for that resulted in the German retreat and Yafe shaa achas kodem.Most of the death camps were liberated by the Red army.
So I guess the attitude of some jews we will live in Tashkent and Samarkand the so called Jewish front and let the Russian goyim die for us in the effort to defeat Hitler and save the few Jews remaining alive.
I want to add that I have never heard or read of Goyische Red army soldiers killing in an organized manner Jewish red army soldiers.
Of course individual Red army soldiers may have indulged in their wild taaves, but the Red army was tightly controlled and I have yet to hear of any episode where the Red army killed Jewish members of its own units . There was no Jewish version of the slaughter at the Katayin Forrest of Polish army officers. by the Communist authorities. .Frankly there were hundreds of Jewish generals , thousnads of colonels and tens of thousands of Jewish lower officers in the Red army.
I just read that when the Red army took over Belz a high ranking officer came to the rav and told him he was his relative a Twersky of course. In Kurenitz a red army officer wasa close relative of R. Yaakov Landau and so on.
kopuster
my point exactly......
My Father z"l and some of his friends ran away to Russia from the fascist Hungarian work battalions into which they were conscripted at the beginning of the war and ended up in Siberia for 4 years (they were suspected of being spies). I remember him telling me that he never encountered antisemitism from the Russians. They were very fair and were only concerned that you pull your weight, always telling the prisoners: Nye Robota, Nye Kleba (No work, No bread). What your religion was didn't matter to them. When he went back to Hungary after the war to see who was left and to settle some scores, wearing a Russian uniform was a distinct advantage for him. Many of the Russian officers accompanying him were Jewish themselves and made quick work of collaborators and Nazi sympathizers. Some scores were definitely settled courtesy of the Russians and also courtesy of Jews dressed in Russian uniforms.
Schneur's position seems to be pretty widely held. It seems pretty clear from the writings of Naftali Loewenthal that Chabad changed between the rebbe Rashab and the rebbe Rayyatz, starting to pull away from the old view of the Old Rebbe that the rebbe was a spiritual guide for those who would engage in meditation and self-perfection, towards the view of the Rebbe as Tzinnor between Man & God, or as the Yechida Klollis. Bittul used to be something that anyone could aspire to directly, not just through the Rebbe.
I was at a neighbor's house for lunch, and we were talking about Lubavitch, how I've found learning their texts, esp. those of the Rashab and the Mittler Rebbe, fascinating, as they were the chief proponents of the meditative program. He too held that Chabad changed after 1920, and even more after 1951, the Rebbes going from spiritual guidance to a cult of personality.
I read something in a Beis Moshiach by R' LY Ginsburg, maybe 2 years ago, how the avodah of the first six generations was different from the avodah of the seventh generation, and the avodah of the post-seventh generation today, is different than the avodah of the seventh generation, and those who pine for the old avodah, just don't "get it" and should be converted or abandoned. So even the Meshichistim are aware of a change in the derech of Lubavitch.
I recall eading the same article in Bais Moshiach. R. Ginzberg a mashpia in KChabad wrote that todyas chasssidim are more chashuv than the chassidim of yore !
So I guess the believe in Yeridas hadeyres is also a victim.
Ginsburgh was fired from kfar chabad two years ago, and is widely known as a meshugene. he now teaches in a yeshiva ketana for two hours a day.
RealMalach
Let me tell you a story Reb shimele zelichover was a bit of a time a masgiach in tomche tmimim Warsaw one day reb shimele saw a bochur learning a mamar of the ryat配 so reb shimele criticized the mamar and reb shimele was out of a job so I asked once the most known talmid of reb shimele living today may hasem give him long years (real malach you probably know who I mean if yes just confirm by writing the first letter of his surname on the blog) how comes reb shimele should speak like this on the ryat配 so he answered the fault was of his rebbe reb shimelle that each great person has a dark period and that was reb shimele dark period but Reb shimelle talmid would not say anything on the rayat配
KOPUSTER you mean Reb Y.Y Y D. I am related to him ,I spoke with him many times about his Gersa D'yankasa in T. T. he diden't want to talk against the Rayatz .I think because Bira D'Shosa By Meya...
Real Malach
Thanks how are you related could it be your brother is a son in law of Rav Y.Y.Y.D may hashem give him long years
1) Regarding what you wrote please note that I have just now heard that your relation gave out a book against Zionism in English he had originally wanted to give it out in loshon kodesh and he asked the ryayt配 who answered there is enough seforim against Zionism in loson kodesh but there is no sefer in English against Zionism
2) Because Bira D'Shosa By Meya... what about Lublin and kaminetz you must agree if your korev holds of the ryat"z that there must be something could be his mesiras nefesh in Russia could be the ryat"z fight against the agudah
3) if you are who I thing you are how is your father may hashem give him long years I once asked your brother how comes your father let you be a malach he never answered
Kind regards
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