Naftoli is right. You should write a check to every shliach out there (it's a brachah for parnasah that he was giving you). Hey, you felt close enough to Lubavitch to go to the farby didn't you?
davzh | 05.01.06 - 12:42 am | #

Reb Naftuli is a warm Jew. He has alot of Ahavas Yisroel.
Ma. Rabbi | 05.01.06 - 12:47 am | #

TZemach u are in LA now?
gruntig | Homepage | 05.01.06 - 3:03 am | #

A long time ago I got caught by Hurricane Hugo while on the way to New York. I had never met or heard of them before, but the Estulins put me up over Shabbos and got me to the airport the next day. I remember the shabbos I spent with them very warmly.
Joe in Australia | 05.01.06 - 3:54 am | #

You're so right. Since the Rebbe's passing when they lost the sense of real bonding with people they have fabricated a new religion of "us and them". It used to be "they are also us sooner or later". Now it is "us and them". Their fake "varm feeling" is there only when you are used as a tool for them to get across the message that if "you (generic) are not part of the revelation you are not saved" (as opposed to the message: "you are part of the revelation...whether you know it or not").
tzorichiyun | 05.01.06 - 9:16 am | #

TA,

You are so on the mark.
Hamas | 05.01.06 - 10:06 am | #

This is all very intersting. I recall an editorial articel in Beis Moshiach shorty after 9/11/01 where Naftali said something all together different. The gist of it was, there are 'us'=chayolei beis dovid and 'them', Who ever is not with us is of OBL's people. I found the comparison to be very disturbing. By the way, what was he doing in Boston? I know he's in NY quite often, he makes spot appearances around farbrengen tables the world over. Can anyone offer some real insight?
lipovitzer | 05.01.06 - 12:10 pm | #

Mayshe Schwartz (originally from LA) invited him to farbreng.
Tzemach Atlas | Homepage | 05.01.06 - 12:12 pm | #

TA, out of curiousity, did he call you a "Baal Eisek" or a businessman, or did he just silently make that assertion?

BTW, the anti/mishichist fight is pretty old, and some trace it back to russia..

I'm working on coherence ;)
Radomsker | 05.01.06 - 1:03 pm | #

Is Mayshe a Mishichist?
Tzfania | 05.01.06 - 1:38 pm | #

Tzemach, Rabbi Chaim Ciment is a meshichist AND a self-styled head shliach?

Radomsker, What was it's form in russia?

lipovitzer, he didn't use a pen name? That's unusual for the BM.
Timmy | 05.01.06 - 2:23 pm | #

Ciment and Mayshe are not Meshichiten.
Tzemach Atlas | Homepage | 05.01.06 - 2:34 pm | #

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Edited By Siteowner
Hamas | 05.01.06 - 2:45 pm | #

Timmy,
Last I checked ( and this is going back a good few years, when I last read either the BM or KH) he writes under his own name.
lipovitzer | 05.01.06 - 2:59 pm | #

Radomsker,

How old r'u? What kind of baloney were you fed about life in the old country?
Nachman | 05.01.06 - 3:16 pm | #

what happend to the comments?
Tzemach Atlas | Homepage | 05.01.06 - 8:00 pm | #

Disappointing.
Tzemach Atlas | Homepage | 05.01.06 - 8:28 pm | #

radomsk and russia are worlds apart...
abc | 05.02.06 - 12:07 am | #

I met Estulin about 30 years ago (yikes!) and when he found out that I daven Nusach Ashkenaz, he responded: "You daven Ashkenaz? I make for you a briss!" I suppose that I'm still in danger there... :-)
Jake | 05.02.06 - 2:20 am | #

Assuming that the majority of the readership never experienced the old samarakand community firsthand, we can safely assert that all (Or most) of the knowledge about the old community comes from what we've heard; perhaps iv'e been misinformed - but is certain subtlty of the aforementioned certainly holds ground. Some people say that the whole Schwei-Osdoba thing is also affiliated with the aforementioned

Glad someone knows where/what Radomsk is :)
Radomsker | 05.02.06 - 10:40 am | #

Rad,
R'Osdoba is a 'tzugekiminer' ( I wonder if he or R'Heller have if'I-only-knew-then-what-I-know-now moments') and the people backing him are esentially no different than the opposition.
lipovitzer | 05.02.06 - 11:09 am | #

What is this BD argument. I do not get it at all.
Tzemach Atlas | Homepage | 05.02.06 - 11:52 am | #

pissing contest. power struggle. you know, the regular.
sto pratzent | 05.02.06 - 12:06 pm | #

But Schwei isn't - that's my point. Besides, i was talking about intergezha conflicts. whatever, this matter, as well as my assertions about it shouldn't be looked upon too seriously.
Radomsker | 05.02.06 - 1:14 pm | #

lipovitzer,
R. Ozdoba seems to fully agree with what he knows now.
As for R. Heller, he has tight control over his Kolel & Shul. As far as he's concerned, Messianism is for idiots has no place around him.
Timmy | 05.02.06 - 2:42 pm | #

My point is somewhat more cynical.Here you have two people coming from backgrounds where learning and learners are regarded with respect, to a place where they are esentially political footballs. When was the last time you saw a community event a Melavah Malkah, Dinner ect. 'crowned' with the presence of a Rov. do their lettters or scholary tretise appear often, and are promoted by, the Yeshivas, Shuls and Moisdos?
lipovitzer | 05.02.06 - 5:39 pm | #

In that respect, as well , i think R. Heller has fared better.
He's made some smart decisions to stay above and out of the politics & stupidity.
Timmy | 05.02.06 - 11:12 pm | #

A Rov which doesn't take hold of matters is not a rov. Whether the Rabbonim are legit or not (see K & co.) they certainly must be leaders and enact upon what they believe in - especially when there is a need for it. This comment is not particularly directed at R. Heller, since i'm not really aware of what he is (not) doing and saying - but a rov must be a strong figure. We have askmoses for questions in halacha.
Radomsker | 05.03.06 - 4:02 am | #

I think a large part of the blame belongs with R' Heller. He doesn't need to stay involved if he doesn't want to but he must at least take a stand once to put the BD on a proper footing. Only then is he free to do what he wants.
AP | 05.04.06 - 10:56 pm | #