mentalblog.com comments:
Ephraim,
All of what you say is true, very true.
But Tzemach is also right.
With the disappearance of the Jewish commonwealth (despite the persistance of Jewish ethnarchs in the empires that controlled Babylonia), and despite the teraching that Torah is not ba-shomayim, but here on earth to be interpreted, adumbrated, and adapted, the legal and governmental genius of Torah became stagnant and ossified.
Gandalin,
I absolutely agree.
I guess Jews channeled their genius either in becoming satellite ethnic and ideological entities in hosting states (major accusation of German Nazis), and/or in developing virtual-space-based sovereignties - like science, art, finance, journalism, etc.
I am toying with an idea that Torah first came up with a judicial society, and later Prophets came up with an idea of universalism of human history, and throughout exile Jews came up with an idea of universalism of experience.
When I am trying to envision the prophetic (especially Isaiah and Hosea) vision of Messianic times, what comes up is a stateless global village governed not by political or military power, but by spiritual ideas and Utopian reality. I don't know whether there is a prescribed way to get there, or whether State of Israel as a political entity gets us closer or further from this vision, and whether it is a political phenomenon that will grow into a spiritual one. I know only that Jews did carry through generations ideas and inspiration that most of the times were greater than they themselves could fathom or live up to.
I guess, Moshe Rabenu was fully aware of a revolution he was ushering - of society of unified concept of equal justice that protects its subjects by virtue of them residing under its jurisdiction (compare to medieval practice of a stranger being viewed as prey free for all in a city not his, or on the road), and of one God, the Ultimate Other that has no image toward whom the mankind is striving.
I guess, prophets who spoke about justice not only as society organizing principle but as global historical determinant that propels mankind toward Utopian future of Oneness, were also quite aware what they were talking about as they lived in an era of global violence and chaos.
I guess that Sages of Talmud and Mishna were aware of revolutionary concept of adversarial judicial process that they invented.
My guess is that Arizal was aware of spiritual revolution of turning this world from a shadow of other worlds into a central stage of cosmic drama of reconciliation.
My guess is also that Besht knew that he was revolutionary in his perception of reality as a place where God attains simplicity of His being.
But it feels like there were only singular individuals who "got it" and were aware of what they were doing, and others were technocrats of spirituality, who dictated the course Judaism as social institution was/is taking. (And maybe it is impossible the other way?)
To go back to your claim that Jewish commonwealth disappeared, and with it the genius of Torah became stagnant. Maybe Torah evolved from establishing an earth-and-society bricks-and-mortar oriented spatial-anthropological order to virtual experiential spaces. (I am unsure if my last sentence makes sense even.) If this is true, I guess that Lubavitch enterprise of creating universal commonwealth of Shluchim is an interesting experiment in global apolitical network-based society (I am totally disregarding the actual implementation), which was a cutting edge of the emerging era of global centers of power other than political and military (like OPEC, Al Qaeda, EU, Google, World Bank, Peace Corps, etc.).
Your thoughts are welcome.
Ephraim,
Well the way to get to the Messianic times is via Moschiach.
When political entities attempt to create the Messianic Era themselves, in Eric Voegelin's phrase to "immanentize the eschaton," the result is always a nightmare.
Leave Moschiach to HaKadosh Baruch Hu.
The purpose of Medinat Israel is not to be a messianic perfect world, but to be a State where it is permissible to be a Jew, where Jews can openly exercise State power, as Jews. That is indeed a worthy goal, but a problematic reality -- especially for those messianists (whether Jewish or not, whether religious or not) who persist in asserting that a less-than-perfect Jewish State does not deserve to exist, because its reality detracts from their messianic dreams.
I think that in the unlikely event that Moschiach does not come soon and in our days, a Jewish commonwealth might eventually learn to embody more and more of the Jewish revolutions you describe, one by one, bit by bit, daf by daf.
I am definitely not looking for the State of Israel to be a perfect messianic state. I grew up in one, and I know the nightmare first hand.
This is exactly why I said that I have been thinking lately that Messianic solution is an apolitical one.
But for the same reason that I don't trust a state to be perfect I have very hard time trusting Messiah as a person. I dread totalitarian regimes, be it dynastic monarchy, or political dictatorship, or ideological oligarchy.
Ephraim,
You're right.
That's why, in the political realm, what we in America call conservatism (what in Western Europe is called liberalism) stresses the facts that people aren't perfect, their world isn't perfect, and the best society is one which acknowledges those facts and allows individuals to make their own choices and their own decisions, to find the solutions that are best for them.
That is the opposite of the totalitarian vision.
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