Tell us what you think...
I'll tell you what I think - I think you guys brought up a few good points. I still think I'm correct though, but at least you guys kept your cool for the most part. We all know how each other feels about the topic and now I'm curious to see what the BoP readers think.
Y'all? Speak UP!
Sorry GTL... I often agree with you, but not this time...
In case anyone missed it here is NSA's Mission Statement "The ability to understand the secret communications of our foreign adversaries while protecting our own communications -- a capability in which the United States leads the world -- gives our nation a unique advantage."
Personally if you are receiving calls from questionable people in questionable places I would want those calls monitored, and I don't care who you are. In fact I would find the government at greater fault for not finding out to whom, and why you are making or receiving calls from persons or places of interest.
The average citizen would be shocked at the lengths that our intelligence agencies go to in order to keep this country safe. The average citizen would also be paralyzed if they really knew the level of threats facing this nation.
For the most part the people in our intelligence agencies are patriots doing a hard, dirty, dangerous, and thankless job. Their job is to see it coming before it gets here, and do what is necessary to ensure that Average Joe/Joesophene citizen never knows what could have been.
They could care less if you are talking to granny who is on a world tour of countries ending in "stan", but they have to be sure that granny is not picking up fissionable material for shipment back to the states in cargo container #6.
If granny did pick up fissionable material, I do expect them to know what grannies last burp tasted like, as well as when you last talked to granny. Additionally if you have been identified as speaking to a person of interest (granny in this case) I expect them to know how long you take to brush your teeth in the morning, and just how long was that piece of dental floss you used this morning.
And yes I would want that surveillance to start immediately, regardless of the "law". We can make nice with the "law" once the threat has been identified and under surveillance, because the bad guys are not going to wait until we get a court order. Once the threat has been identified and quantified it is time to start the paperwork.
As Mark stated "Unreasonable" is the important word in the 4th amendment...
Mark is also correct that a crime has been committed in the release of this information.
There should be prosecution of everyone involved in the leak from the individual that leaked the information to the people publishing the information. Freedom of the press doe not extend to criminal acts...
Oops..
Matthew not Mark...
Thanks Kirk.
Mark, I can't buy the argument that meeting the FISA criteria is just too onerous. If you're just fishing, you don't have enough to wiretap the citizenry. If you have a case, put up the tap and take it to FISA. I'm not a lawyer either, but average people in this country grasp that there is a proceedure in place. We're also getting that following proceedure is "hard work". We're fighting terrorists... is that supposed to be easy?
GTL, I would rather watch my back and have my privacy -- every day of the week. How smaller government morphed into big brother government in 5 years is beyond me. Brrrrr.
Jet:
"I would rather watch my back and have my privacy -- every day of the week."
Yes Ma'am... indeed!
Nariel:
Yes Ma'am... INDEED!!!
Kirk:
"For the most part the people in our intelligence agencies are patriots doing a hard, dirty, dangerous, and thankless job."
We agree on that one, man! Nobody is above the law however, not even them. If I, as a military member must obey LOAC, then I expect the intelligence people to obey the Constitution, know what I mean?
Kudos to Zaphriel and Mark also, for voicing their opinions respectfully and providing links and sources. We disagree on this one, but that's okay (so far) in today's America.
I'm interested in seeing what others have to say. Commenters?
I think your naive to the actual technology involved thsi debate occurs as if we still have individual phones and the calls run through fixed line exchanges. Wiretap's in the old sense dont exist anymore , there are no wires. This concept from "overseas" and not domestic calls is naive as well. What if someone makes a call via Skype or MSN and as if they say Jihad Jihad bomb Jihad flight 101 in a thick Arabic accent and some computer goes "ding ding ding" and fires an alarm off to some operative who goes "oh look Mohamaad Bin Laden" is about blow up xxxxx.
Folks what amazes me is the depth of the debate. its like we are having the debate in a 1950's technology bubble , except we are in 2006.
The are eaves dropping on almost everything you do. Thats the elephant in the room.
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